Ni-No-Kuni Nut
just to fill people in on what this is:
http://www.computerandvideogames.com...e=1#top_bannerSony Gaikai: 5 cloud features that could revolutionise PSN
Last edited by Gribble-Grunger; 07-02-2012 at 04:14 PM.
Main Screen Turn On!
Well... I know what it is... it's just that I am not really interested in not owning my games... I already am on the verge of "losing" a lot of my games when PS4 hits (I am sure a lot of games will not function as they did before, because a potential PS4 will not be able to emulate a PS3). VERY much unlike Steam, where I can even use Wine on Linux to play my games. And activate ALL of the PCs I use, not just 2. It just "works".
But... we'll see... maybe it won't be AS bad. But I can't see how.
Kept you waiting
Ni-No-Kuni Nut
why would the PS4 need to emulate the PS3? you've lost meOriginally Posted by Segitz
total destruction
YET is the key word in that statement. Also, "yet" doesn't imply non existent. In other words, it doesn't mean that games won't be playable on said device. Like YouTube, they just won't be playable at the current quality a console game would. For example, with a decent connection, most game could run at 720p. It's not a bad quality, but it's not the best quality that your standard television outputs either. But, when you're talking about gamers or just reaching out to a broader user base, does it really matter? The key is that It's doable enough for EVERY USER to simply pick up and play. You don't need hardcore setings to do that, and that's what makes it so special.
-
It's @Gribble-Grunger 's day today.
You May Already Own a PlayStation 4
They could say: "Try the PS4 right now, on your PS3."
Cloud computing is definitely the buzz in general in the computing world, so people like Gribble and these journalist, professionals like Gaikai and Sony even are right to look towards that way but I really think once people get over the buzz and the downfalls of it are brought to the surface over time, it won't survive.
For me gaming going digital means Steam. Not streaming but everything at great prices, at one place, superb support AND it can go across platforms, currently MAC+PC, Linux soon. And in a dream world on PS3 as well. Imagine having access to all your Steam games on PS3, that for me is the future, not streaming everything at fuzzy 720p to my screen and during an immersive cutscene in MGS, the server cuts out or someone in my house starts downloading something and suddenly Snake's face turns into a puke of mud.
No I want to still have afeeling of me "owning something" in my HDD, can play independently of any service for peace of mind and keep the quality and crispness AND response the way the game was designed.
I am not dissing streaming services, they are obviously not for me, but I am more just giving the voice that sees another way into the future.
*madhouse's offical creepy old guy*
lol master, ya thats the way i see digital a steam like service for all
Last edited by Smokey; 07-02-2012 at 06:28 PM.
my PSN name is smokey777
Originally posted julps31
The truth. MGS has aged gracefully. MGS1 = MILF
Main Screen Turn On!
Well... there'll be a time when either my PS3 will die and I have little interest in replacing it, Sony shuts down "old servers" taking away the ability to play my old games... ... the are many reasons. Emulation is my word for BC. There's little reason to think Sony will include a partial PS3 (probably Cell) into PS4 to emulate PS3 games. It didn't work out for PS2 games and it surely won't work for PS3 games in the future. And I doubt PS4s CPU will be a Cell derivate/upgrade.
So the only reason for them to force Gaikai upon me is such a system... and that won't last forever, I assume. I still own old ass PC and Amiga games, which I can play without problem on PC, because... I can do WHATEVER on my PC. Yes, I can reconfigure my PC disk drives to make it read Amiga discs (usually they are incompatible). If Gaikai will be the only way to use my PS3 games in the future, then... well fuck that. I don't want to depend on Sony to give me this ability... what happens, if they go bankrupt? Will I lose all my PSN games?
Kept you waiting
total destruction
........which is why I don't think physical/digital copies will ever go away -- not now anyway. I think we may still have two versions of the game; a digital download version and a stream version, but I'm just not sure how Sony plans to incorporate it into these GaiKai servers or how PC games will work. I mean, Sony knows that the connection isn't robust enough to switch entirely to this. Hell, the guy in charge of Sony's game division even said so himself.
Why So Serious?
Erm I just tried to use Gaikai service to stream some games on PC. Wouldn't let me, said my bandwidth was too low so I guess me and my brother won't be using this or making much use of the service if it's a major feature to play games of PS4, certainly hope not as I won't be buying it otherwise. If my connection gets upgraded great, atm I guess its piss poor.
Ni-No-Kuni Nut
exactly. Once the PS4 hits though, there will be absolutely no reason at all to bring out another console. we still haven't see the full potential of the PS3 yet and the PS4 will be exactly the same. games will be eye popping for years and years before better games start to appear server side only. but those that already have a great connection will be able to play the latest Crysis on there PS3 or even Vitas NOW
so you won't buy a PS4 because it gives you an 'option' you can't use? good job those without internet at all still bought a PS3certainly hope not as I won't be buying it otherwise
Last edited by Gribble-Grunger; 07-02-2012 at 11:37 PM.
Why So Serious?
Read what I wrote, I said 'if its a major feature to play games on PS4' then I won't buy it, I don't live in an area with high bandwith to accommodate stream gaming.
And yes, why would I buy system where there's a major feature I can't use to play/try ps4 games or other games, its like buying a WiiU but the tablet controller is disabled.
Teh_Insider
There are 3 things this streaming service will be used for.
1. Full Game Trials - It would save Sony a hell of a lot of bandwidth to be able to let users stream the trial instead of making them download the entire game and locking a portion of it.
2. Demos - Get to play the game much faster, the many people won't download a demo if it's above a couple GB's, so this would enable instant access to demos.
3. B/C - PS2 games on PS3/Vita, PS3 games on Vita, PS1/2/3 games on PS4, etc...
- A LunaticYou wanna destroy the nation, balance the budget.
total destruction
That too, but I think a little more than that is in store. Why would Samsung still be on board and why are PC developers on board? I doubt Sony is simply gonna give these guys all of their previous jewels without a hitch, and they are not going to simply tell them that they can't use the platform for their device as it makes Sony money. It sounds to me like a trojan. Developer figure by joining the server, they can reach out to a wider user base. Every time a device uses it, Sony get the profit. When a one of Sony's games are purchased, Sony gets the profit. Every time a game is put on their server, the PlayStation devices are connected to it. It reminds me a lot like PlayStation Mobile in a streaming version.
Last edited by Domination; 07-03-2012 at 02:09 AM.
Ni-No-Kuni Nut
A well written article:
http://www.1up.com/news/sony-gaikai-...ke-up-industrySony's Gaikai Acquisition Could Shake Up the Industry
Many believe the future of the games industry is in cloud gaming, where the game you're playing is run on servers located at a datacenter (as opposed to the console/handheld/PC in your home) and streamed to a screen -- a TV, computer, phone, tablet, etc. Should that prove to be the case, Sony has ensured it will be prepared by acquiring cloud gaming company Gaikai for $380 million. It's a deal which has numerous implications, the most intriguing of which is what the cloud's implementation will be in the PlayStation 4 and how that potentially negates the need for another PlayStation console to ever be released.
Back in May it was reported that a deal between Sony and either Gaikai or OnLive would be announced at E3. It's possible that was the case, and due to the particulars still being worked out, an announcement could not be made as planned; the press release Sony Computer Entertainment sent out last night notes the deal still has to go through closing conditions and the usual regulatory stuff. Those should be no issue at all, and knowing the deal is with Gaikai enables us to now better brainstorm what things could look like down the road.
The official announcement gives no indication of where things are headed except to say SCE will "establish a new cloud service, ensuring that it continues to provide users with truly innovative and immersive interactive entertainment experiences." That doesn't tell us much of anything, leaving us to contemplate the possibilities like in May.
Most likely Gaikai will not have a significant presence on PlayStation 3. With the PS4 reportedly coming later next year, it would make sense for cloud gaming to instead be a key aspect of the new console. That does not mean PS3 owners won't see anything new; cloud demos are among the most straightforward benefits to gamers, and something that seems like it could be implemented without too much trouble. Gaikai's existing service is best known for allowing games to be demoed right from within a browser, whether it be on a retailer's website or even Facebook. It's easy to see this sort of service being brought to both the PS3 and Vita (and the PS4, down the line), either through a dedicated app or perhaps as part of the PlayStation Store itself.
The ability to sample a portion of a game immediately without having to wait for it to download is an enticing concept, and the beauty of Gaikai is a demo does not have to be specifically put together by the developers. The Facebook demo of Saints Row: The Third, for example, simply allows the first 45 minutes of the game to be played without any hassle. Publishers could still build a demo if they so wish, or they could opt to make the entire game available for a set amount of play time. As I noted back in May, streaming demos would be especially welcome on Vita, a system which lacks internal storage and uses pricey proprietary memory cards. Whether they are embedded right into the PlayStation Store or accessible through the browser or a Gaikai app, the ability to sample any game without delay is the sort of thing that could give the system a boost at a time where it's facing increased competition not just from the 3DS, but also mobiles phones and tablets.
Backwards compatibility is another area bolstered by the cloud. Think of a PlayStation 4 capable of streaming any PS1, PS2, PSP, and possibly even PlayStation 3 game. Because the burden for running these games is placed on Gaikai's servers and not your own console, the existing need to include the appropriate hardware to run older titles (such as the PS2's Emotion Engine being included with early models of the PS3) would no longer be the case. It's a stretch to assume the entire library of PlayStation titles being offered on such a service due to rights issues, yet the desire of publishers to make money off of their back catalogs should not be underestimated, particularly if Sony and Gaikai make it easy to offer those games up.
When the cloud gaming deal was first rumored in May, I thought PlayStation Plus subscribers would eventually be given access to full versions of streaming games. Instead at E3 Sony announced a regular rotation of PS3 games that subscribers could download and keep for as long their subscription is active. Shifting this aspect of the program from downloads to streaming games in the future seems like a natural way to go, both because it will avoid the unpleasantness of downloading such a huge amount of data and because it gives Sony more control over how and when those games are played.
In addition to (or in place of) this, Sony might even offer a standalone subscription service that grants instant access to a larger number of streaming games, almost like a videogame version of Netflix's Watch Instantly service. Not everyone may like the idea of paying to play games they will only have access to when their subscription is active, but the availability of a premium service that grants access to hundreds of games from multiple PlayStation systems sounds like a nice bullet point for Sony to have when it comes time to sell gamers on the PS4.
There are other possible benefits for Sony in making this deal, such as saving gamers the trouble of ever patching their games. I've also heard the idea of Internet-connected kiosks in stores that allow customers to sample every game on PS4 or Vita with the push of button, which would be much more effective than the limited offerings seen in kiosks presently.
There is some bad news in all of this, although just how it will affect you may vary. As I mentioned with the idea of streaming games for Plus users, Sony would gain a great deal of control over how games are played. Selling or buying used games would be impossible with streaming games, nor would it be possible to borrow games from friends. The latter issue could be covered to some degree by streaming demos, although many would hate losing the ability to have a physical copy of a game in-hand that they could do whatever they please with. Gamers take issue with the occasional game that requires an Internet connection to play; all streaming games would invariably require a constant, stable connection to the Internet.
The solace for those who shudder at the thought is the fact that the PS4 will undoubtedly offer disc-based games (just as we know the Vita will continue to offer downloadable and card-based games). Cloud gaming will, at least initially, be presented as an optional way of playing games, and in some cases it may still manage to be of use to those who despise always-online requirements. Imagine being able to continue playing any PS3 or PS4 game on your Vita while on the go. The issue of how the lack of L2/R2 buttons are handled aside (mapping them to the rear touch pad is one possibility, albeit not an ideal one), that would be a big step forward from the current situation where this can be done with the occasional game.
Eventually, though, cloud gaming could prove to be the sole method of distribution for games. In theory, the PS4 could be the last console you ever have to purchase. While its hardware will age over time, it will always be capable of handling streaming content, so as advances are made in technology and new games require higher-end hardware, Gaikai's servers could be upgraded to handle that demand. So although the first portion of the PS4's life will operate similarly to the current generation, by the time 2020 rolls around we might see games requiring hardware exceeding the PS4's capabilities offered to PS4 owners exclusively as streaming titles.
Even if cloud gaming is implemented in the PS4 right out of the box, there will probably be no need to worry about missing out on games as a result of having a poor Internet connection. While we've been seeing many games offered exclusively as downloads this generation, publishers know there is a difference between consumers with Internet connections capable of downloading a title and those with Internet connections capable of providing a competent streaming game experience. (Some Gaikai demos work with 3Mbps connections, but generally 5+ is desirable.) At this point in time, few have access to the kind of connections necessary to play a streaming game that is indistinguishable from one that is played locally. However, between advances by ISPs and Gaikai improving its technology, that may no longer be the case a decade from now and publishers could feel more comfortable offering streaming-only games. (It remains questionable how viable streaming games will be for those with bandwidth caps).
We likely will not be hearing about specifics on how Gaikai will be taken advantage of for some time; certainly its PlayStation 4 presence won't be revealed until the system itself has been announced, meaning those details may not come out until next year's E3. There are a lot of other questions that still need to be addressed, too, such as how Sony will handle Gaikai's partnerships with competitors like LG; will it use those existing deals to let consumers sample games that can only be played in full on PlayStation 4 or Vita? At the very least, Kaz Hirai, with his new "One Sony" initiative, would presumably like to see Gaikai's technology leveraged outside of the PlayStation systems.
Whatever the case may be, this Gaikai deal stands a chance of dramatically changing the gaming industry and the way new consoles are released in order to keep up with technological advances, not to mention the pressure it puts on Microsoft not to fall behind in the cloud space. Whether it manages to do that with an OnLive acquisition or something else, it should be incredibly interesting to see where things go from here.
PSTWii60
I don't get what Samsung has in this? I mean i own a Samsung UE46D8000 so sony/gaikai will develop games for them and will be competing against sony nintendo and microsoft at the same time?
edit i would love to beta test... where to sign up? lol
Last edited by FantasyGhost; 07-03-2012 at 10:55 PM.
PSN: FantasyGhost
total destruction
Whoa.... check this out:
I gotta agree with this guy. I, too, began questioning the bandwidth myself for certain areas, and the head of SCE game studios even said so himself when he was asked about a cloud servers streaming games. He thought the standard for Mbps wasn't high enough in some areas to really push for a GaiKai and Onlive strategy yet. If I find it again, imma edit this post. But it makes more sense that Sony probably had a whole nother vision for cloud gaming (probably related to something else they discovered during R&D), which they haven't mentioned yet, that may also coincide with an idea from one of GaiKai's patents. So the best way to proceed with that ambition was to buy GaiKai out.Most of the fuss about Sony’s recent acquisition of cloud-based streaming service Gaikai is how Sony will integrate the service into its games and systems. However, I find it unlikely that Sony acquired Gaikai simply to use it. It’s much more likely that it was bought for its patents—either allowing Sony to develop a future cloud-based technology without repercussions or allowing Sony to follow through with a technology that already exists…without getting sued. The latter is probably the reality.
full report at the link
By simply just picking up GaiKai and using their tech as show at E3, I'd expect something like that from Microsoft (Zcam vs Kinect) (Zcam vs PSeye & Move). Sony has usually been more on the cutting edge.
EDIT
Alright, I found it.
Will the future of Playstation look harder at add-on services, further motion sensing, augmented reality or cloud gaming?
I think those avenues are valid and it’s definitely a good idea to make use of cloud gaming technologies. We’ve been looking at the variety of technologies we could include in the Playstation ecosystem. We’ve been looking at the variety of technologies we could include in the Playstation ecosystem. We looked at different motion sensing tech and our vision analysis technologies to create PS Move for example.
We’ve been looking at streaming tech as well, and one of the examples we had was what we call remote play. Remote Play was where you connect your PSP through the internet to your PS3. It is like a cloud gaming service at a fundamental level in terms of how the mechanic itself works.
Cloud gaming services allow us to stream games via a server to different devices, but in order for it to become practical, the internet has to be very robust in terms of bandwidth and latency. As with all things infrastructure, it takes time for it to become widely available. Some consumers in the US and some parts of Europe have very robust and fast net speeds, so cloud gaming would be practical in those markets, but not when you look at the wider, broader global market.
Cloud gaming, because it’s so easy for consumers and is so convenient (ie you don’t have to do any big downloads, installation or setup). When there are faster internet connections, gaming in the cloud as a subscription service could become a reality.
We’re looking at what OnLive is doing, and the tech around that, and considering how this can be a part of Playstation.
full interview
Last edited by Domination; 07-04-2012 at 02:11 AM.
Hasa Diga Eebowai
Codemasters co-founder: 'PS4 and Xbox 720 must go digital only or face extinction'
For people who should know a thing or two about technology and how it is in the world many of these publishers are saying idiotic things.
Your Amicable Overlord
Extinction of Codemasters games? Oh save us from the horrors! *crickets*
Main Screen Turn On!
Um... why would the ability to load games off a disc or usb stick or whatever "make a system go exstinct"? I mean, on PS3, a lot of games are already available as downloadable (very different to MS or Nintendo), some even day one or as preorder... PSPGo didn't go anywhere "download only"... and that was with small games on a portable system...
And with Internet being "cut down" at the moment, with caps implemented, I can't see that happening...
Kept you waiting
*madhouse's offical creepy old guy*
cliffy must work for Codemasters
my PSN name is smokey777
Originally posted julps31
The truth. MGS has aged gracefully. MGS1 = MILF
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